Card Feedback/Suggestions Collaboration (work in progress)

[Verticules 192]

CARD FEEDBACK/SUGGESTIONS: This is still a work in progress.

_{Current Contributors}@RubyRose @TehPers @Human_Cancer @Splice @Verticules

Card Feedback/Suggestion Google Docs: ETERNAL CARDS COMING SOON!

• FOCUS CARDS
• Eternal Cards

Edited March 25 by Verticules

[Verticules 192]

KNOWN CARD BUGS/EXPLOITS: COMING SOON!

 

Edited March 24 by Verticules

[Verticules 192]

STARTER DECK REVISIONS:

Starter Cards were good at giving players a feeling of what the Eternal had to offer, but the order of cards wasn't fully thought out. During Beta I made it a point to show players that the cards were fine, but that reordering the cards was something that needed to be done. With the help of a few other members of the community, we were able to find those orders, sadly we didn't do a demo for all of the Eternals. (Dread, Nautica, and Niia are from memory I may have error'd on what cards were Starter Cards)

• Bristle Card Order: Seedling, Log Club, Regrowth, Bark Armor, Trample, Lasting Walls (repeated 7-12) _{Built and Demo'd by} @Darkon
• Bristle Demo Video: Youtube Link

 

• Dread Card Order: Savage Splitter, Rapid Reload, Defiler, Effective Range, Ravager, Instant Bag (repeated 7-12) _{Built by}@Urabask

 

• Nautica Card Order: Trident, Absorb, Drop in the Ocean, Oceans Boon, Water Works, Tides Return (repeated 7-12) _{Built by}@RubyRose

 

• Niia Card Order: Trail Blazer, Fire Spirit Trap, Specter, Venomous Bite, Lingering Haunt, Trap Shot (repeated 7-12) _{Built by}@RubyRose

 

• Ray Card Order: Pulse Pistol, Engineering Mastery_{(Modded Torch instead of 2nd copy)}, Disruptor Turret, Heat Sink, Reinforced Gizmos, Emergency Repair (repeated 7-12) _{Built and Demo'd by}@Verticules
• Ray Demo Video: Youtube Link

 

• Winter Card Order: Typhon, Cooling Winds, Bottomless Mag, Maridite Mortar, Maridite Typhon, Extended Pistol Mag (repeated 7-12) _{Built and Demo'd by}@Verticules
• Winter Demo Video: Youtube Link

Edited March 24 by Verticules

[Human_Cancer 113]

I have been summoned from the dark, unholy depths of the internet, I guess. Anyway, I might as well put in my 2¢ regarding the only eternal I was ever decent at, Nautica. I want to preface this by saying that these past four months have left my memory on Nautica a bit hazy. I also never unlocked all of her cards, but I did see them in action. Oh, and I’m also tryping this on my phone, so the formatting and capitalization might be a bit screwy.

The Fabled

The Revivithan: I’m pretty sure this was Nautica’s only legendary (don’t quote me on this). It was also immensely useful. Basically, it revived your entire team at your location and spawned a giant dragon that healed everyone around it. It was basically a better are more badass conch of fallen heros. I liked it a lot, and I’m still a bit salty I never managed to get one.

Power-ups and abilities

The conch of fallen heros: It was very good. I honestly don’t think it needed to be changed.

Tide’s return and drop in the ocean: Good cards ruined by how long it took to get them in a match. Seriously, 15 seconds was far too long.

Ocean’s boon: Probably the second most controversial card next to the conch. With the trident, this was definitely a bit op. I’d argue that the duration of this should be lowered to only a few seconds, but the amount of healing should be tripled instead of doubled. The timer should be lowered as well. Basically, I think this should be something that should be only used in occasionally to absolutely make sure everyone around you gets back to full health quickly.

Whale of a time: I loved this card, but it was also completely useless. It’s healing was minimal, and no one ever bothered to actually stand in its path either. It was also extremely hard to aim as well. The only reason I or anyone else used it was because of how majestic and funny it was. This card needs to be either healily reworked or removed entirely.

The piranha card: This was very useful if you ever decided that someone near you needed to die. It made Nautica’s already good melee even better. Can’t go wrong with that.

Poison Waters: A pretty useful power-up when combined with the bident. It dealt pretty decent damage and was pretty threatening. Overall, it was good.

Sea’s Gift: This card was surprisingly useful. The little healing pickups were decent and popped out frequently when in a firefight. It also had a relatively low timer as well.

Upgrades

(I can’t remember the name of this card, but it’s the one that heals you when you heal other people): One of Nautica’s most useful cards. There’s nothing about it that I’d really want to change. The challenge on the card was perfect for it, and it was extremely useful as long as you were actually doing your job as a Nautica.

Ocean’s fury (I think that’s what it’s called) and the card that added damage to your summons: These cards were useful, but not by very much. The amount of damage they added was negligible for how their timers were.

Weapons

The Bident: I still have fond memories of this thing, mostly of silently slaughtering people before it was nerfed (possibly due to me abusing it and doing said slaughtering). This mixed with the two cards that increased your damage was an absolute monster, but after the nerf it was a bit underwhelming. It essentially went from what the Amprex is now in warframe to what it was before beam weapons were recently reworked and consumed ammo just as fast. You could only use it to kill one or two Niias before it ran dry. Most disappointing of all is the fact that this is Nautica’s best weapon (for killing people). Again, underwhelming.

The Cyclone Staff: I wanted to like this weapon, and I wanted it to be good. Sadly, there was no way to make it work. The damage was too low, and the hit boxes were wonky at best. It was super inconsistent.

The Wave Bracer: This weapon was definitely one of Nautica’s better ones. The utility of it is quite high, as being slow in this game equals death. This is especially true when you have an angry aquaman surfing up to you spamming e in an attempt to fist you to death.

The Urchin Guantlet: This weapon has the potential to be good, but it’s not. The damage is too low, and it’s impossible to actually hit anyone with it. The spead of the guantlet is, oddly enough, on the right side of the screen. This means that in order to actually hit someone with it, you have to look slightly to the left of them. I’m sure anyone reading this can understand why that’s a problem.

The Trident: Nautica’s signiture weapon. There’s actually nothing quite wrong with it. The healing is good, and there’s no reason to use the damage part of it anyway so the extremely low damage doesn’t even matter.

 

And that’s all, folks. Correct me if any of this is wrong (especially the names please). Overall, even though I said this on the discord, most of Nautica’s cards are simply too niche to be useful in most situations. She’s a good character, but she really needs a lot of cards fully reworked or tweaked. Timers need to be changed across the board as well *cough* *cough* RAY *cough* *cough*

Edited March 8 by Human_Cancer
Just remembered that the highest tier was fabled, not legendary. Whoops. I also remembered two more cards.

[Verticules 192]

Update:

Added More to the Basic Section

Added Dread and Niia

[Verticules 192]

With some input from @RubyRose I have made further changes to Dread and the Basic section.

[TehPers 156]

Poison Boost

• Fix poison boost not boosting poison damage while you're dead

I'll think of more stuff later, but I really haven't played this game in so long that I doubt I'd be much help.

Edited March 13 by TehPers

[Verticules 192]

12 minutes ago, TehPers said:

 

I'll think of more stuff later, but I really haven't played this game in so long that I doubt I'd be much help.

None of us have lol

[TehPers 156]

Alright, I think I'm finally tired enough to post something decent. Don't ask how that works. Anyway, this is just gonna be a jumbled mess, but whatever.

Niia

• She had huge damage potential in the form of Dreamcatcher and her bow, with great late-game potential with her crossbow. Specter was also a powerful weapon that allowed Niia to play at closer range, however it honestly just felt like an alternative to Dreamcatcher most of the time. My suggestion with her weapons is simple: decrease Dreamcatcher's short-range damage and have it ramp up to full damage once the bullet reaches a certain distance from her. Specter, on the other hand, should be stronger at mid-range versus long range, but I can't think of anything off the top of my head right now.
• There was one weekend during the alpha (I believe) where a bug caused Trap Mastery to be applied every time you respawned, causing the max trap limit to skyrocket. Let's just say her trap build was absolutely amazing. That aside, I have to agree with Vert's suggestion:

  On 3/7/2018 at 8:48 AM, Verticules said:

  Trap Mastery: There really shouldn't be a card requirement for Niia to get more than 1 trap . Traps in general never lasted that long (cept a well placed Wind Trap). Players tended to be pretty good at destroying or setting off traps prior to Niia reaching device caps. I suggest this card instead increase the amount of times traps will trigger before they despawn and give her a three trap limit.

• Niia, as far as I could tell, had a gunner build and a bow build. However, there were two lesser used builds as well: trapper, and crossbow. Traps were often used to augment existing builds. For example, the darts haunted enemies in range, which made it possible to track them through walls and snipe them when their heads popped out. I'd like to see a full trapper build though. To start with, traps are fairly easy to notice and experienced players will always seek them out. A lot of people have suggested making them more difficult to spot, but what if you could hide them on walls instead? Also, it might be neat to see more upgrades/power ups for trap cards, like trap damage or a power up that gives your traps an extra trigger or something. As for the crossbow build, it was very powerful at late game to the point that a single poison dart from the crossbow could eventually kill Bristle in one shot if the game lasted long enough. A simple solution to Niia's (and Ray's) upgrade decks being so powerful late game would be to replace Upgrade Focus and Power Up Focus with different cards entirely. This would also mean their upgrades (and power ups to a lesser extent) would need to be buffed a tad. Poison Boost could be replaced with "Poison Ticks deal +2 damage per tick" maybe, which would result in 20 more damage overall. In a poison focused build, by mid-game (which is around 4 stacks with the super long timers from late beta), that'd be +80 overall damage, bringing Crossbow's total damage up from 100/10s to 180/10s. Additionally, I can't remember if it did, but only allow a single poison proc per shot (so Venomous Bite wouldn't buff Crossbow's damage to 260/10s per shot). A couple interesting power ups could be added as well.

Here's some things I'd suggest adding to her:

• Maybe add a power up (doesn't last very long, ofc) that restores a portion of the poison damage she does as healing to herself? It would add a small amount of self-sustain to her build, but with such a low health cap, it wouldn't be super powerful at all. Additionally, it'd be neat to see some more support focused traps.
• Although Niia is no Ray, it might be neat to see a trap that does a small AoE burst of healing when an ally in range drops to low health (or possibly even if they would die). It would be something small, but could save Niia if she gets spotted or even give the team that last minor push toward capturing the fragment you've been fighting over.
• It would be neat if there was an upgrade that increased trap effectiveness. For damage focused traps, it'd just increase damage (fire trap would have increased initial damage probably). For traps like Grounding Totem and the slow trap, it'd increase the slow amount slightly. For the healing trap suggested above, it'd increase the healing.
• It might be neat to see a trap Niia can deploy that acts similar to Vauban's bounce pad. She doesn't have much of a way to get to high ground, so it could get her up to the nice sniper perches while still being a consumable. However, it'd be much more limited than jetpack and UFO, giving Ray the upper hand in mobility.

Ray

Welp, it's been a long time since I played as Ray. Anyway, he had two main builds, as far as I could tell:

• Gunner, using Von and Atomic primarily
• Turrets, which relied on Disruptor Turret and UFO

Both builds ran as many burn cards as possible. Ray's timers were so high that it was next to impossible to keep up your weapons as a gunner without running basically just weapons and burn. Anyway, I think it'd be neat to see a third build for Ray, as an alternative to Nautica almost: support, which focuses on healing and buffing. He has plenty of healing options already, however not many for support.

• Add a force field generator of some sort. It blocks enemy bullets and projectiles, however the generator itself is vulnerable to close range attacks and the force field has a limited amount of health. It would have cracks in it as a visual indicator of how much health it has left.
• Heal chain, oh boy. Let it chain through allies with full health. A healing station should be able to chain through three people and heal someone who is a good distance away. Maybe redo the card to be more like this: "Heal Chain: Support beams chain through +1 allies. Each ally chained through lowers the effect by 20%." It would be able to chain to an ally with a maximum distance based on the range of the source. For example, if a healing station had a range of 5 meters and there were allies 5m and 10m from the station in a line, then it should be able to reach that second ally (although it'd be 20% less effective).
• Ray's Von and Atomic are pretty great where they are, though I'd suggest removing Heat Sink in favor of a card that increased the rate heat was lost. This means that you couldn't get huge bursts from Von, but it'd still increase the overall fire rate. Maybe change it to something like this: "Heat Sink: Weapon heat is dispersed 25% faster."
• Ray of Hope is really powerful with his mini med station. Instead of the healing station, what if he had some kind of unique tower, like one that gave shields to allies in range? It'd still provide sustain and a form of healing, but it wouldn't allow Ray to sit and camp with three med stations near him and never die due to the extreme healing. Also, having his main ability as healing seems odd for a character who isn't a dedicated healer.

Edited March 13 by TehPers

[TehPers 156]

Oh, I almost forgot. This is just a minor suggestion and it's been made many times before. Drop the kill cam. It'll always be buggy and honestly it's more useful to know what the situation is like during the respawn timer so you can plan a bit.

[Verticules 192]

For those that have already read this, prior to me deleting most of it, I am working on a different idea that requires less rework to the current game. It is looking very promising stay tuned.

[Urabask 378]

On 3/13/2018 at 10:14 PM, Verticules said:

For those that have already read this, prior to me deleting most of it, I am working on a different idea that requires less rework to the current game. It is looking very promising stay tuned.

The game needs a rework though.  The foremost problem it had was that no one knew about the game but after that it was seen as a generic FPS in an "oversaturated" genre.  Overwatch makes it very difficult for the game to be successful as is, heck, Paladins was supposed to be the exception and they made one misstep and lost half of their players.  

I think they could overcome a lot of the stigma hero shooters have to face by making the game PvE with a PvP option.  The problem most PvE games have with PvP is that they make the barrier to entry way too high.  If they could overcome this and make a PvE game that has accessible PvP it would be a pretty unique game.  Hero shooter rosters would lend themselves well to letting DE play to their strengths and they could make a decent instance based loot shooter.

About the only game in recent memory I can think of that tried anything similar was Firefall but they overreached pretty hard by making it open world.

[Blueberry 6]

Haven't checked the forums in a while. Glad to see these discussions are still happening. 

Winter:

In terms of card and timer tweaks, I definitely think Winter's melee cards need another pass. Playing melee-deck towards the end of the beta was really difficult due to the crazy long timers on his cards. I don't remember the specific cards I was using, but the effects were something like this:

• Increase melee damage by +X - this one, being the core of the melee deck (obviously), probably needed a shorter timer. The damage boost itself was fine, but it didn't occur often enough during a normal match to make melee Winter viable against characters with guns.
• 2x melee damage for X seconds - This one was almost right. Timer for sure needed to be shorter, but the effect and duration seemed mostly fair.
• DOT on melee hits for X seconds - The timer was insanely long on this card and the DOT effect was pretty weak. Could be more useful if the timer was shortened and either the duration or the damage-per-tick were increased.

 

I can't think of any other cards (besides Nautica's "Drop In The Ocean" & "Tides Return", which Human_Cancer already mentioned) that bothered me a whole lot right now, but I'll add to this post if I remember something else.

[Verticules 192]

15 hours ago, Blueberry said:

In terms of card and timer tweaks, I definitely think Winter's melee cards need another pass.

Winter's Melee timers were in line with Dread's. The issue wasn't card potency, it was that Winter didn't have the passive backstab that niia and dread had, or the mobility without using an upgrade (slider).

 

Edited March 18 by Verticules

[Verticules 192]

Post Updated with the newest version of the revamp.

[Blueberry 6]

On 3/18/2018 at 9:51 AM, Verticules said:

Winter's Melee timers were in line with Dread's. The issue wasn't card potency, it was that Winter didn't have the passive backstab that niia and dread had, or the mobility without using an upgrade (slider).

 

On 3/6/2018 at 9:58 AM, Verticules said:

Winter's melee card timers are balanced with his lack of backstab.

Fair enough. This works, too.

I'm liking the changes you've made so far. Keep up the good work!

[Verticules 192]

• the focus card doc is up
• the starter deck revisions are up.

Edited March 25 by Verticules